Meth kit

[Pappy]

Who here has used em? Which company would you recommend? Anything I should know?

[amanda]

it's addicting. be safe.

[Pappy]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nQZLOCqglvA/SXisvx7mG6I/AAAAAAAAA9c/LP0XSiziqNM/s400/unamused.jpg

[David A]

I hear Cooling Mist is pretty good...most guys I know made their own tanks and ran a custom setup, though.

[Pappy]

im more looking into one with a very good safe guard system. I know some will cut boost if they see flow stop or the pump go out. that is what i am most concerned with

[pdexta]

A lot of the miata guys use Devil's Own and it seems to get a lot of positive feedback, no personal experience though.

http://www.alcohol-injection.com/
<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

[RoadRunner]

AEM progressive kit
Expand it to run direct port injection
Run a pre filter after the pump and before the nozzles
J&S safegaurd
/thread

[RoadRunner]

dbl post

[Pappy]

AEM progressive kit
J&S safegaurd
/thread

ill have to look into that, do you use it?

[Anthony]

i have a devils own kit on my car and its ok.i would get a snow performance or a aquamist kit for your car.yboth come with fail safes and both are pretty highquality
\

*edit* also go with a dual nozzle setup

[STiDriven]

Snow performance is good. They have stand alone failsafe that you can get from their site. My tuner said they were a pain to install and didn't use steel braided line and didn't like the quick snap connectors. He recommended SMC but I think my tuner is affiliated by SMC.

Or If you want to be a baller go with aquimist HF5(I believe it's called). It comes with all the bells and whistles.

[RoadRunner]

ill have to look into that, do you use it?

I did a lot of research and contacted many mechanical engineers on the subject of methanol and water injection. One of the main people I talked to was Bob Hatton a designer for Turbo F1 cars, design developer for NOS Nitrous Oxide Systems back in the 1980s, and has been fitting N2O & H2O systems since 1978.

I grew a nice little informative FAQ sheet that is still growing and I'm still modifying it. I'll post it here:


Q: Where should I install the injection?
A: One per cylinder at the end of the intake manifold runners. Get it as close to the intake valves as possible so that the water doesn't have time to turn to steam. Turning to steam is somewhat unlikely in a pressurized atmosphere, however it can start to warm up and expand, which will displace more air than when it is cooler.

Q: I don't want to deal with drilling the intake manifold and buying more injectors. Is it better to put water injection as close to the tb as possible rather than near the intercooler? Does ideal nozzle placement differ for meth and water applications?
A:Think of it this way.
Why do we not just have one fuel injector up by the TB on our engines?
There are a number of engines that do it that way.
It is because it is better to get the fuel into the cylinders as soon as possible and not get drop out in the manifold. Also with four injectors, you will get the correct amount into each cylinder.
Anything we add to the engine, methanol, water or nitrous should have four injectors all down by the inlet valves.


Q: My intake manifold is still on the car, won't I get aluminum shavings in the motor and valve area if I drill and tap it while in the car?
A: Drill the bottom of the manifold so that gravity is working with you. Work slowly and in stages so that you can clean the area constantly to prevent the shavings from getting tossed into the intake manifold.

Put grease on the drill bit and on the tap. The shavings will stick to the grease. I have done it this way countless times without incident.

Q: How do I know what to run? Should I just inject water, methanol, a mixture? And isn't injecting N2O to cool the intake charge basically going to do teh same thing?
A:Water and methanol do totally different things in the cylinders. One is a fuel and will make the engine run richer [methanol], the other will let you take fuel away and lean the engine out and not get any detonation [water].

Methanol is a fuel, nitrous is oxygen and nitrogen so not the same at all.

By injecting methanol into an engine either mixed in the fuel or into the inlet is just like using an octane booster, not much if any cooling of the in coming air.
Nitrous on the other hand super cools the incoming air but extra fuel has to be added or the engine will run very lean and a big bang.

A 50 hp nitrous kit will give 100 hp on a blown engine because of its cooling, but the right fuel pump will be needed for all the extra fuel.


Q: Should I be running a progressive controller or is it okay to start with a boost activated switch for now?
A: For WOT runs, on/off is sufficient.

If you have a simple on/off switch, I would just start with that. If you find that at whatever cc injection you end up with, you are bogging during daily driving because you regularly hit [your activation set point], then change over to a more expensive progressive controller. I just learned to drive around it. I just stay under [my activation set point] at part throttle by habit. If I am going to dig into the throttle and go beyond [my activation set point], I just make sure I am at maybe 75% throttle or more so it does not bog down when the injection kicks in.

Q: I am considering purchasing a water injection kit but don't know what percentage of water or methanol to run. If I just want to use it to prevent knock and to raise the boost only by 2psi, what should I use?
A:
100% water will give you the higher octane as well and allow you to run much more than 1-2psi more boost if you wanted. The ONLY reason to use meth along with water is if you have run out of fuel with your injectors and want to use meth or water/meth instead of getting larger injectors. If you aren't going to tune for the added fuel, straight water is what you want. Adding any % of meth to your car without tuning for it is like adding larger injectors and not tuning for them.


Q:I was originally considering a A2W setup, but have decided on a water injection kit. It actually seemed simpler plumbing wise. I understand that for the high WHP setups (eg. 433 on race, 398 pump), that should use larger nozzles and get a progressive controller. Please correct me if that is wrong.
A: If you want more power then an A2W intercooler is the way to go. Water injection is used to stop detonation only, it will not give inter-cooling to give more power. Anything that is injected into the air stream will displace air and that is the last thing we want to do.

Q: If water injection doesn't add power, then what is the point?
A: Water injection does not add power, correct. However, you are adding the water to cool down the combustion temperatures and further prevent ping and knock. This allows us to run more timing or more boost. Tune properly with the right tools like a W/B and a knock monitoring system.

Q:If I have it tuned to N WHP on race gas, could I run that same boost level on 93 octane + water injection? How would I know how much water to run or if it would even work.
A: Yes you should be able to do that. I am unable to tell you how much you need, you just have to try it out and add more if needed.

Again, using proper tuning devices like a W/B is needed.

:Which is better for prolonged track days events --A2W or A2A + Injection? Could I actually run out of water before I run out of fuel?
A: A2W will give the power, water injection will help to keep the engine together and yes you could run out of water before fuel depending how much you use and the size of you tank.

Q: How much heat can water and methanol absorb?
A: The latent heat of water is 970 BTU's - meth is 473. So 1400 cc's of meth has the cooling effect of roughly 700cc's of water.





Methanol is used on a limited basis to fuel internal combustion engines, mainly by virtue of the fact that it is not nearly as flammable as gasoline. Methanol is harder to ignite than gasoline and produces just one-eighth of the heat upon burning.

Methanol is required with a supercharged engine in a Top Alcohol Dragster and, until the end of the 2006 season, all vehicles in the Indianapolis 500 had to run methanol. Mud racers have mixed methanol with gasoline and nitrous oxide to produce more power than gasoline and nitrous oxide alone.

One of the drawbacks of methanol as a fuel is its corrosivity to some metals, including aluminium. Methanol, although a weak acid, attacks the oxide coating that normally protects the aluminium from corrosion:

6 CH3OH + Al2O3 → 2 Al(OCH3)3 + 3 H2O

The resulting methoxide salts are soluble in methanol, resulting in clean aluminium surface, which is readily oxidized by some dissolved oxygen. Also the methanol can act as an oxidizer:

6 CH3OH + 2 Al → 2 Al(OCH3)3 + 3 H2

This reciprocal process effectively fuels corrosion until either the metal is eaten away or the concentration of CH3OH is negligible. Concerns with methanol's corrosivity have been addressed by using methanol compatible materials, and fuel additives that serve as corrosion inhibitor

[2jzHunting]

Aquamist the priciest tag but best failsafe and warnings out there. Also Perrin sells a kit that is made up of basically aquamist parts for cheaper.

[IMPORTIMAGE]

on my sti i used the coolingmist varicool setup...now they have new setups that work well, i get the aem as well. the new cmgs kits have gauges and all sorts of things for those who are well...paranoid

[Victor]

on my sti i used the coolingmist varicool setup...now they have new setups that work well, i get the aem as well. the new cmgs kits have gauges and all sorts of things for those who are well...paranoid


I bought a cooling mist kit from Josh way back when, I never installed it but it seemed like a great quality kit. i really loved the integrated design of the tank and pump.

From what I have hear about the AEM kit you might want to pass on it, not as good as other brands.

[RoadRunner]

McMaster Carr is a great place to get parts to expand your system or if you want to create your own.

McMaster.com

McMaster Carr link directly to their nozzles:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#misting-nozzles/=1yfca9

McMaster Carr also sells a lot of fittings:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#pipe-fittings/=1yfcq4

McMaster Carr also sells tubing:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#tubing/=1yfd73

McMaster Carr also sells SS braided tubing (or braided hose):
http://www.mcmaster.com/#braided-hose/=1yfe7k

[StrictlyBusiness]

I have a Sow Perforance Meth Kit and it works awesome. I would reccamend the same to you. They have been around awhile.

[BlackMagicGTO]

I have a devils own progressive kit works fine for me i spent 426$ and it came with everything....... IMO the alky control kits are one of the best but there around 700$

[RoadRunner]

In reality, most of the kits use the same parts and pumps. They all have differences in their controllers but the pumps are mostly all Shurflo, and the parts and fittings are all brass or nickle plated brass.

In the end, it all comes down to the controller.